Save With Fear Pulling Them Out of The Fire

There have always been those who attempt to divert God’s people from their main purpose.  Whether angels or men.  God knows how to deal with the rebellious, but believers are warned not to participate with any such persons.  The wicked  appeals to the lusts of the eye, lusts of the flesh and to inordinate pride.  They will pretend to love God, appear to do good works, but on close examination they are as fruitless as the fig tree that Jesus cursed.  The wise will be able to identify those whose object is to be god, rather than to serve God.  It will take a deeply spiritual heart to know how to reach any who are deep into deception without being contaminated-hating the sin but still loving the sinner. – Jack W. Hayford (revised by myself)

I am tired…… sick and tired of running after the false teachers and leaders.. that I use to run after….  thinking they were right……what’s up with that? I have realized that I’m still following after these bozo’s! Oh- for very different reasons for sure …..once I believed them, now I want to warn everyone to stay away from them……How’s that workin for me? Not so much!! It seems I can only take so much information on the heresy these guys teach before I over load and have to step away. Who knows, maybe that’s normal for most of us, I don’t know?

I have read more information, articles, books, tweets, and listened to their sermons: I now know more  about what they teach than I ever did when I was blindly following them! Had I looked at them this closely from the beginning, obviously I wouldn’t have followed them! But I still find myself hanging out with them much more than I want to! Why is it that the very ones that I was deceived by are the ones I still  spend so much time listening too?

  • hang on every word, much like their followers who adore and idolize them do.
  • help them with their income by buying there latest book, so as to “critique” it and show how much they are still teaching and preaching heresy.
  • Notice these books have, what I called orchestrated controversy and the publicists release the book earlier than scheduled because of the “controversy”…… translation is that it sells more books = more MONEY.

I know that it is critically important for those whom God is calling out of this deception to have the information out there on these false teachers. I thank God for the bloggers and discernment ministries daily. Let me say clearly that I am in no way wanting to diminish the work that they do for God in calling out these false prophets.

My point is, OK their FALSE, they are teaching false doctrines  and heresy’s. It’s obvious!! Many other’s long before I arrived on the scene have tried to correct and instruct them in their error, to no avail. So what good am I doing or anyone else for that matter by chasing after their next statement, sermon, healing conferences, or books.

We already know they are and will continue to twist the scripture, teach another Jesus and basically do what false teachers do. Scripture doesn’t tell us that many will turn back to the truth, it states the opposite, many will fall away from the truth and follow after these false prophets.

These guys are not interested in the truth. More importantly how many times do you present them with the truth before it becomes “throwing your pearls before swine”?

Jude 22-24   “And of some have compassion, making a difference:  23  And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.  24  Now unto him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy.”

We know who is teaching false doctrines, we have a list of those who twist scripture. We are still waiting for many of them to respond and defend their “position” with a Biblical based defense, “in context” would be nice!

I plan on doing things a little differently , instead of wasting so much time and energy running after false teachers, their next book, sermon, tweet etc. I want to focus more on those who follow them.

The facts are  already known;

  • their teaching heresy
  • they refuse correction, instruction, or to be accountable
  • and if they did/do repent I’m sure they would want to make it known to the world, so as to save those from the fire that they have been deceiving all of these years.

Has anyone noticed that most don’t really respond to or defend the doctrine that they are teaching to any who are questioning their Biblical validity? Several reasons for this:

  • They can’t Biblically defend their position and to enter into a debate “contending” for what they believe wouldn’t line up with scripture.
  • By not engaging those who are scrutinizing their doctrines they accomplish a couple of different things. One; they effectively “separate” themselves from those inquiring, setting up a “US and THEM” mentality within their ranks, “THEM” of course being the “bad guys” or the “unenlightened”. Which of course sets up the mind set of “aren’t we special.” Two; that sets up by default division which of course is flipped back onto those asking the questions to begin with and they are the ones that are being viewed as divisive for even questioning!! Crazy how that works but it’s working for them isn’t it.
  • By not engaging in response it actually in some ways promotes them and keeps them in the news so to speak. No matter if it’s good or bad, publicity at least they are being talked about. Look at almost every book that is cranked out by them. Anymore they actually promote their material as controversial……sells more books….gets more coverage….even the secular world will pick up the story and guess what…..they sell more books. Then the publishers release it earlier than planned because of all the hype……
  • By not responding and defending what they are teaching it creates a vacuum of sorts for those who follow them, “their sheep” are left to defend them. In some respects that works to the advantage of those who are flagging their teachings as heresy; because at least there is an opportunity to engage and hopefully save some of them out of it. But in reality those like Bill Johnson who promotes a gathering around the “FATHERS” should feel a little sheepish himself (no pun intended) in the fact that he is allowing the “children/sheep” as it were to defend the “FATHERS/leaders” leaving the sheep to defend the shepherd!!!! Kind of flies in the face of the fathers as protector doesn’t it.
  • Also in some ways I’m sure they are hoping that by not engaging and defending they appear to be taking the proverbial  “high road” and somehow appear more like Jesus. Unfortunately that is certainly not what scripture says to do, let alone Christ never missed an opportunity to preach and defend the gospel. To always have an answer to all men. Yet they seem to be “above” the fray so to speak. One it keeps them from really having to come up with intelligent scriptural responses, in reality this can only last so long until even the most diehard fan/follower has got to start wondering if maybe what the dissenters are saying isn’t actually true.

Then by not responding it begs the questions and statements.

  • Why aren’t they concerned about clearing up the doctrinal error questions?? Especially for those that follow them? To give them clarity and a solid Biblical basis for them to be able to build themselves up in their faith and stand and defend and contend for the faith?
  • As leaders they appear to fail miserably in protecting and defending their faith, it’s role reversal, their flocks are out in the trenches fighting for their “leaders” and aren’t adequately equipped to defend them or what they teach. I can’t tell you how many comments I have read from people defending Johnson and crew, where the poor person that is commenting  is using statements like “I’m sure this is what he believes…..or that’s not what he means by that” you get the picture.
  • I’m sure those who follow these guys would love for them to show up on some of these bloggers sites and give them what for or at least give the sheep/flock some solid defense to take with them when they go to defend them!
  • One of the most tragic and I think spiritually criminal is the very fact that they truly lack compassion, grace, and mercy, not only for those they deem deceived (what a golden opportunity to win some!!) but for their very own!!!!
  • You can only conclude that they have more than enough followers that they aren’t too concerned about those that venture into the controversy over their teachings and get slaughtered and destroyed trying to defend them. Apparently the parable of the one lost sheep going astray  or wondering off where it shouldn’t doesn’t carry much weight with them. They certainly aren’t concerned about possibly losing a few being crippled or maimed!!!!
  • They do not take accountability or responsibility for the very things that they are presenting as truth. If they really believed and were convinced that they hold the truth, wouldn’t they at all cost continually present a defense for it? Knowing that some will be saved, even if it’s one it would be worth it? Where’s their compassion and love for the truth they claim they have when they won’t stand in defense of it? The conclusion is that those following these ministries will have to ask themselves these questions someday. Again scripture is clear, always have an answer for all men.

2 Timothy 2:4  Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

1 Peter 3:15  But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear.

2 Thess. 3:1-2 Finally, brethren, pray for us, that the word of the Lord may have free course, and be glorified, even as it is with you:  And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith.

How shameful it is to look at just how little concern these false prophets have for those who follow them, but then look at how little they are concerned with defending their own faith…you have to wonder  (usually most people will defend what they believe vehemently and often to death) do these guys even believe what they are teaching?  They don’t step up, why?  Don’t they trust God is faithful enough to defend His own and His own Word? Yes I’m being facetious .

My point is I know at times I have lost my spiritual compass in all of this…’s not hard to do!  For me, I just want to really try and refocus on those out there that are in despair, broken, destroyed and hurting all at the hands of wolves like these. If they choose to repent that would be beyond wonderful; but until then the only mention I want to give of them is to all who are hurting and broken from their deception that they are spewing, God has and is calling you out.


2 Thessalonians 2:9-11

“The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie.”



1. an act or instance of deluding.

2. the state of being deluded.

3. a false belief or opinion: delusions of grandeur.

4. Psychiatry . a fixed false belief that is resistant to reason or confrontation with actual fact: a paranoid delusion

Strongs Concordance :

The Greek word delusion is 4106 πλάνη [ plane / plan ·ay /] deceit, delusion, roams hither and thither, wrong opinion relative to morals or religion, error which shows itself in action, a wrong mode of acting.

So someone who is deluded has little or no hope of recovery, because their belief is fixed, unmovable , resistant to any form of reasoning or confrontation with the actual facts. It then becomes a paranoid delusion:
What are Paranoid Delusions? Delusions are beliefs that are not backed up by reality. They may remain despite obvious evidence to the contrary, and the fact that nobody else believes them to be true. Sad thing is that there are many.
Add to that fact that the delusion is sent by God Himself “Strong” delusion

The Greek for STRONG: 1753 ἐνέργεια [ energeia / en· erg ·i·ah /] in the NT used only of superhuman power, whether of God or of the Devil. operation, working, efficiency

     I always thought it was interesting that it wasn’t the truth that they didn’t receive, but rather the LOVE of the truth. Which means they take the truth and apply it to their own desires, which then makes the truth a lie. It’s a “wrong opinion relative to morals and religion, error which shows it’s self in action or a wrong mode of acting.

     It’s no wonder that when I’ve listened, watched , read these guys materials, sermons, fire tunnels, laughing spirit etc. that I would always come away feeling like I had just visited a freak sideshow of the spiritually crazed. I now realize that is exactly what I have done. It becomes evident in their strange and bizarre behaviors and their strange and bizarre explanations (Biblical or extra) for their actions. If what we are seeing today is the beginning of the strong delusion then there is no doubt these are on their way or are already reprobate and if we think we have heard and seen strange things to date……we “aint seen nothing yet”

     No wonder they think it’s acceptable to “follow after signs and wonder” with the conclusion that eventually the signs and wonders will follow them, the delusion causes them to ” roam hither and thither.” I cannot express in words how thankful I am the God has saved me from this.

     That’s why when you ask yourself the questions like;  How can they possibly believe that crawling around on the floor barking like a dog, clucking like a chicken, roaring, or laughing, staggering like a drunken sailor, token on the Holy Ghost etc. gives glory to God almighty in any way shape or form? They look at you as if your some sort of freak for not understand that they have arrived, and automatically assume your envious of their supernatural/spiritual level.

     Usually their only answer, if any, may be that they don’t understand it either but that doesn’t mean it’s not from God. It has to be God, they’re in a church service, they seeking and praying for more etc. Sadly they are correct, it is from God, the strong delusion was sent by God because they would not receive the love of the truth.

     Going one step further in 2 Timothy 4:3-4 “For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;  4  And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.” It turns into a vicious cycle, a never ending drunk in the spirit, slain in the spirit, bless me party; that so closely resembles the world that the only difference is the sign out in front of the building that says church instead of Bar.

     Were not just dealing with a misconception in the thinking process. There are demonic influences that are playing out here . The reality is to strive to have the Love of the Truth you must know that the truth is going to skin you alive, peel you like a banana, more often than not rub you raw. In our understanding we realize that the truth of God’s Word, uncompromised , unaltered or unchanged, is the only thing that leads us, grows us and delivers us. Love of the truth is keeping the Word pure and intact at all cost. Anything less is a lie.

     The turning away from the truth started when they could no longer endure sound doctrine. Yet, what is good and acceptable in the sight of God is that all men be saved, and come unto the knowledge of the truth (1 Tim 2:3-4). To endure truth is to hold up, or tolerate truth. It’s obvious that they can no longer stomach the truth so they seek out those who will give them what they want to hear instead of what they need to hear. What you end up with is a church full of people who are comfortable, listening to a comfortable speaker giving a comfortable message that contains no Bible doctrine. The focus in 2 Timothy 4:3-4 is on the inclinations of the audience rather than the evil intent of the false teachers. However, for error to thrive both sides of the transaction must assist each other. We live in a time of entertainment, and entertainers become celebrities. More people know more about Joyce Myers, Benny Hinn, Bill Johnson, C. Peter Wagner, Paul Crouch, and Todd Bently than they do Jesus Christ, and the sheep become the groupie’s. Apostasy is rebellion against the truth, add to that, the abandonment of the faith. It’s a revolt against truth and a defection from the faith once delivered to the saints. The allusion of apostasy is the insurrection to the authority of God. Apostasy enslaves people servants of sin where sound doctrine frees people to become employed to righteousness: (Rom. 6:17-18) “But God be thanked that though you were slaves of sin, yet you obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine to which you were delivered. And having been set free from sin, you became slaves of righteousness.” Proverbs 12:17 says: “He who speaks truth declares righteousness, but a false witness deceit.



Healing Rooms and Sozo ministries

Manifestation/Kundalini effects and complications

“A forced awakening that one’s mind and body is not prepared for is incredibly and majorly overwhelming, or even worse, a Kundalini eruption that is premature, ouch,  The danger in raising this energy in the first place is one thing for sure.  Your nervous system can become overloaded that you will feel like you are walking on the edge of a building, slipping in and out of sanity, for days, weeks, and even up to years. Breaks from reality and madness have occurred.  Forcing an awakening with even an experienced guru is not guaranteed you success of a trouble-free awakening.”

“As such, some practitioners believe it to be a case of kundalini energy in disarray. Over-zealous practitioners of Kundalini, Qigong or Buddhist meditation, without proper guidance or restraint, were observed to lose touch with reality.[77

Is it any wonder that the Healing Rooms and Sozo “ministries are flourishing in the Hyper/Chars mania world? The question has to be asked are these ministries creating more dysfunctions, psychosis, and illnesses within their own ranks? With an altered sense of reality, along with at times long term physical symptoms, is it any wonder that many caught up in these practices of “manifesting”; seem to be unreachable with a common sense approach to Biblical truths. Below is a list of some of the complications that arise from the “Kundalini awakening”

Mental Confusion

A forced Kundalini spiritual awakening can lead to a break with the real world, especially if the practitioner is not prepared for the power of meditation. Sometimes a hospital visit or other medical treatment is required to overcome the mental confusion.

Gastrointestinal Problems

Kundalini can cause problems with the gastrointestinal system because the awakening takes energy and enzymes from the digestive system to perform the metamorphosis. The immune system is not as available for digestion. The liver is stressed due to working harder to deal with the digestive upset and irritable bowel syndrome (IBS) can develop due to an overworked immune system and increased yeast growth.

Involuntary Movements

Involuntary body movements can occur during Kundalini meditation or later while the practitioner is resting or sleeping. The signs of this are sudden jerking, tremors and shaking. Some people have claimed that an inner force pushed their body into different postures. Movements have been misdiagnosed as epilepsy or restless leg syndrome (RLS

According to these fields of study the Kundalini-syndrome is of a different nature than a single Kundalini episode, such as a Kundalini-rising. The Kundalini-syndrome is a process that might unfold over several months, or even years. If the accompanying symptoms unfold in an intense manner—that de-stabilizes the person—the process is usually interpreted as a Spiritual Emergency (Grof & Grof, 1989; Lukoff, Lu & Turner, 1998).

Motor symptoms are thought to include tremors, shaking, spontaneous or involuntary body-movements and changes in respiratory function. Sensory symptoms are thought to include changes in body-temperature, a feeling of energy running along the spine or progressing upwards in the body, a feeling of electricity in the body, headache and pressure inside of the head, tingling, vibrations and gastro-intestinal problems. Cognitive and affective symptoms are thought to include psychological upheaval, stress, depression, hallucinations (inner visions or accoustical phenomena), depersonalization or de-realization, intense mood-swings, altered states of consciousness, but also moments of bliss and deep peace (Sannella, 1976; Greyson, 1993 & 2000; Greenwell, 1995; Scotton, 1996; Kason, 2000). Within the mentioned academic traditions this symptomatology is often referred to as the Physio-Kundalini syndrome (Sannella, 1976, Greyson 1993; 2000) or Kundalini-experience/awakening (Scotton, 1996; Lukoff, Lu & Turner, 1998). A roaring noise or other loud auditory hallucination have also been reported (perhaps related to the phenomenon of ‘Exploding head syndrome‘). Transpersonal literature emphasizes that this list of symptoms is not meant to be used as a tool for self-diagnosis. Any unusual or marked physical or mental symptom needs to be investigated by a qualified medical doctor (Kason, 2000).

Kundalini energy has also occasionally been abused by various gurus or spiritual teachers of various sects, usually by creating an unhealthy dependence of the disciples upon the guru for ‘energy treatments’. Shoko Asahara of Aum Shinrikyo infamy is an example of this pathological form of guru-disciple relationship maintained through abuse of Kundalini energy.

The philosopher Nietzsche may have also been the victim of a pathological form of kundalini awakening, leading to his breakdown and ‘insanity’, from which he never recovered.

While kundalini problems are not listed in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, through the efforts of David Lukoff, Francis G. Lu and Robert P. Turner, a new diagnostic category called “Religious or Spiritual Problem” was included in the fourth edition, DSM-IV published in 1994. This category was proposed to offset the tendency of mental health professionals to ignore or pathologize religious and spiritual issues brought into treatment.[74] While acknowledging the consensus within transpersonal psychology that kundalini awakening is a form of spiritual emergence or emergency and should not be diagnosed or treated as a mental disorder, some psychologists note it could precipitate forms of mental disorders or exacerbate preexisting conditions.[75]

DSM-IV does include in its “Glossary of culture-bound syndromes” the diagnostic category “Qi-gong Psychotic Reaction“, described as “an acute, time-limited episode characterized by disassociative, paranoid or other psychotic or non-psychotic symptoms[…] Especially vulnerable are individuals who become overly involved in the practice.”.[76] As such, some practitioners believe it to be a case of kundalini energy in disarray. Over-zealous practitioners of Kundalini, Qigong or Buddhist meditation, without proper guidance or restraint, were observed to lose touch with reality.[77

“Disturbingly, some peoples’ egos seem to expand along with their consciousness when they have what they consider to be an advanced Kundalini awakening. I was somewhat shocked when I first came across this, being of the mind that Kundalini would purify any blocks within people and fashion them into human beings equivalent to the Mother Teresas and the Dalai Lamas of this world. Not so; some of the poorest representations of spiritual growth gone wrong have been people with advanced Kundalini experiences, or alleged to be fully enlightened, some of the finest have been those with the most challenging and problem-ridden Kundalini awakenings.”

It’s clear from just the physical manifestations, that what is happening in the hyper/charismatic churches today are identical to the Kundalini awakenings that are happening in non-Christian cultic circles. Having read where even the gurus themselves that are leading these groups, who have spent most of their lives understanding and pursuing the Kundalini awakening have little if any means to assist or help someone who goes off the deep-end and.

This would beg the question of the absolute ignorance of the pastors, prophets, apostles etc. who are opening their church doors to something that they have NO knowledge of whatsoever and yet labeling it God. So how many pastors etc. do you know who are trained or have discernment in identifying when someone who is “manifesting” is in trouble???? All you hear them shout is “MORE LORD MORE”, rather a frightening thought isn’t it, when someone actually may be having a “spiritual emergency,” and someone is shouting MORE!!!!!!

I personally know and have heard from others who follow after these “manifestation” experiences, that for a period of time afterwards they experience jerking, shaking, body contortions, speaking difficulties etc. and sometimes these effects last for weeks. Those are JUST the physical.

What will be the outcome of the long term effects of “manifesting”? Most hyper/charismatic churches that I know of practice these manifestations every week, if not in ever service. Do they send them off to their Healing Rooms or Sozo’s? Where more of the same is practiced, so they get a double dose!!! There is so much more that can be said and studied that this article could go on forever.


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